The Good Library Blog

I have already explained to you why this would create problems and I can't ignore them because they effect both libraries and their users.

With no indication of which library authority owns the book the reader may well be unsure of which library to return it to.

Books returned to the wrong authority will be more difficult to spot and in some cases it may be inpossible to find out who the real owner is.

In the meantime the reader will be charged overdue fines or the cost of the lost book.

If the books are stamped with the library name and contact details in house then surely the cost of staff time has to be factored into any possible gain.

Hi Miriam,
I don't think the 'whose coat is this jacket' problem would be such an issue. Most people will know which library system lent them the book.
I am more concerned as to how to save time in the other area you mention, i.e. putting 'tracking' info on book. RFID is an obvious answer, but would be very expensive initially.

Miriam

What you said was that there are some places where people might return books to the wrong place and that on some of these occasions that might cause a problem.

Do we have to incur the huge cost of labelling everything in order to avoid the relatively small cost of these occasions?

I use the same argument when librarians tell me that every Science Fiction book has to carry a "Sci Fi" sticker (in addition to the information which a publisher has placed on the book to make that clear in the first place) so that a few staff in a few libraries who wouldn't recognise a Science fiction book, don't put it back in the wrong place.

(And besides: is using Dewey for arranging a library socially inclusive? !! )

Pete

It's not hard to put a unique copy number on a book- if it is done in an efficient way at the printer or the supplier. (Borders do it) That would allow your library management system to recognise what was loaned by you and what was not.

Tim,
indeed, my concern here was would that impeded the stock mobility you spoke of? I guess a discreet number wouldn't impact too much.

Pete, I think that it would be far more common than you imagine and the costs in replacing lost books and admin fees as well as the loss of goodwill from readers shouldn't be ignored.

Tim, as I also said earlier, if the name (or indeed an identifier) for individual authorities can be printed in the books or on the labels then that's fine (contact details would also be helpful for people who want to phone or use a website to renew books). My main concern is that, as far as possible, our stock is where we think it is.

I have no axe to grind either way about genre spots, I can see arguments for and against (although the information on the cover may not always be as detailed as you think).

I am assuming that the remark about Dewey was facetious.

Dewey is socially inclusive in that it is equally difficult for all ;)

In all seriousness, DDC has efficiency aspects; it would work well with centralised processing for example. And using DDC does not preclude other forms of organisation and use of signs.

I wasn't being facetious about Dewey-- nor was I talking about efficiencies.

I can think of few things more off-putting to a first time public library user than an imcomprehensible set of numbers through which to search for a book they might read.

Libraries who use Dewey display headings behave like a private club in which only the initiated are permitted to participate. Dewey displays should be stopped immediately-- and if the information on a book cover is not sufficient for people who work in libraries to know where to put things, the Bookdata or BDS information is only a bar code reader away.

I am just trying to clarify, is your argument against the use of Dewey in libraries or is it for the use of clear signing and guiding?

The two are not mutually exclusive.

Miriam

What I mean is that the overriding requirement of layout, grouping of titles and signposting of them is to help people find what they are looking for or might be of interest to them, without asking a member of staff.

I object when libraries group sections or titles because that is determined by Dewey classification but does not obviously make sense to an unknowing reader. But more than that I object when libraries use the Dewey numbering system instead of words in everyday use, to signpost sections.

I know that a lot of people who use public libraries regularly like the system and feel at home with it- but I think in this case it is the interest of the less regular reader that has to be paramount for the reasons I gave before. It is, to me a clear example of what is meant by trying to make libraries helpful to all people who want to use them.

I agree completely with what you say about layout, grouping and signing but I don't see why that can't be done within Dewey which groups books by subject.

Any subject grouping can be confusing to someone who isn't used to it (I have great problems finding the non-fiction titles I am looking for in bookshops for example) but I agree that using Dewey alone as shelf guides seems unhelpful. Are there really many libraries that use classification numbers instead of words in their guiding? I would have thought that to be a hindrance to both staff and customer alike.

Rather than doing away with Dewey would it not be more helpful if we all had a policy of inducting new library users: showing them how to use our catalogue, access our online facilities, make reservations and various other services?

Miriam

Thanks again. I think we'd better stick to the bit we agree about over display signage and be pleased with ourselves!

(Incidentally, from what I have seen there are still quite a lot of libraries using numbers instead of words- even in the more general areas of a public library)

I think my way of describing your "induction prgramme" is a guided tour: it should be possible to use the library and enjoy it without takiing up such an offer- but if a reader wishes it could be available.

Life is far too short to be pleased with oneself Tim; I shall leave that to other people.

The phrase “induction programme” sounds extremely disturbing, I’m glad I didn’t use it :)

A guided tour would just be a member of staff showing people around the library. Induction involves showing people how to use the library for themselves. I agree that it should be (and in the most part is) possible to use the library without instruction but I was simply suggesting that the option should be there for people who want or need it.

If you can actually show me a study, which proves that people can find an individual title unaided in a bookshop more easily than in a library, then please produce it

Miriam!
Hi! Your web site is helpful. Many thanks. Best regards!

Why is it so hard to learn to use the Dewey system ? It has served libraries and librarians as well as has Linneus`s system of categorising plants, for many many years. When I went up to University about 1,000 years ago we were given a lecture about using the libraries and handed a sheet of info on Dewey and a way of learning it. It wasn`t difficult and it has stood me in good stead for almost half a century.

There's a library in the US that's doing away with Dewey altogether. See http://tinyurl.com/34gnaa

The labeling is just a minor problem that could be resolved, but the real reason that boxes of new books sit in our staff canteen is that we do not have enough staff to actually add the books to the computer catalogue. We get imported records which don't match our catalogue which then needs editing and the actual copies then have to be added individually. Librarians are all pitching in to help with book processing but the boxes keep arriving faster than we can clear them