The Good Library Blog

I have to write a concluding page for the book that goes to press this week, about U.S. libraries (Heart of the Community: The Libraries We Love, www.librarieswelove.org, but the website isn't at all up to date--wait till you see the actual book pages!), and your first paragraph is almost exactly what I want to say! I agree, yes indeed, and I think most librarians will, too.

Not in the UK they won`t.. they will not agree that libraries are for books or for quiet... they are for 'ideas' and 'community'; and 'inclusion; ' they are for computers and entertainment and ... anything but for books. Anyone who thinks libraries are for books and quiet is deemed to be white, middle aged, middle class and non-PC.
I`m glad it`s better for you in the US.

Yes, hate to write a "chiming in" kind of comment, but you sum it up admirably well. Anyone would think you had been thinking about this problem rather a lot this year.

As you know, I'll put my cross on the form for "Tim Coates for prime minister".

Phil Kerridge posted this earlier: (I have added some replies)

"Tim

Some things may be to think about:

1) There needs to be something about how close libraries are to where people live?

2) Following on from that something for rural areas - who might expect mobile library stops (or something less prescriptive that does the same job) and how often? REPLY Phil-- I think both these are for a separate discussion; here i just want to try and seek agreement about what a good library is.

3)Library websites deserve a mention from a dedicated blogger like you. Catalogues, renewals, reference books and the excellent collections of audio books on the best US sites are I think valuable. REPLY Phil-- I think this falls into the same category as saying libraries should have electric light bulbs: of course they should, and so should all public services of this kind etc

4) There is a conlict between space/quite and children, being welcoming and providing a community space where the mainly elderly and sometimes lonely gather to read newspapers and chat - this maybe needs some elaboration? REPLY I would rather this to an individual library to sort out for themselves

5) Possibly more emphasis than saying "going out of its way" on encouragimg children to use libraries. Possibly something on things like storytimes that might be standard. REPLY Again - I would prefer to leave this to individual libraries: not all children want to be read to.

6)From experience libraries not reinventing their own solutions means that regional or national networks for library or library and cultural systems are developed. I think it needs to be said. ....

7)You probably need to say something about the management culture for want of a better phrase. Focus on performance. Sensible risk management compared to what is imposed on us at the moment that kind of thing.

8) MLA have recognised a need for some sort of marketing nationally. Pretty disastrously I agree. But there is a need. REPLY I wouldn't market the public library service until it was a lot better than it is now. I'm sure that doing it well be an advertisement of its own-- besides the publishing industry is one of the most able marketing operations in the world (every radio programme and newspaper article almost every day is about books) if only the libraries stocked the books that are promoted they would benefit from that brilliant work

Probably tons more but I'll leave that for others."

Well I for one would be strongly in favour of the Ideas Stores in Tower Hamlets, although they would be glaringly of place in Cornwall or Northumberland

Consider for just one minute those who are trying to raise a family in places like Tower Hamlets with its high density housing and heavy demand on social resources.

There must be compromise : those who want libraries in Tower Hamlets to be exclusively for quiet book usage to the exclusion of other learning facilities are not helping this discussion, or giving a hoot about the dangers of social exclusion.

Clive

Can you explain more without using "Ideas Stores" as the reference point? Many will not have seen them and what you are saying is important.

Tim

For example, I live in a very international zone of North London. I can count thirty different languages and countries of origin of my neighbours within sight of my front window. They are European, Asian, American-- and the shops one hundred yards away are of so many cultures, it is truly a fsacination. We all have families of different ages and needs - some people are transient and some are working here to save money to send home.

I believe the role of local library is one which works hard to provide the library needs of all those people. The idea of a public library is an international one. Everybody knows what they are there for and the role they should play. Our local ones try hard, I'm sure, but they lack books and newspapers of many of the languages that are needed. They don't cater as well as they would like for many of the children of so many countries and backgrounds.

But none of these things change the idea of what a library is: it places greater demands and that is certain; but I don't think that replacing the book collections (however grim they were) with a row of PC's connected to the internet does the job that a library should do.

I don't think any of these families would expect the library to take the role of a teacher; but they would hope that the library would help put them in touch with language or skills teaching, or help find the solutions to some special needs of their children.

Tim

I thought you were very unususually prickly when replying to my comments above.

Libraries must be accessible. An excellent library in Exeter (and I am not saying whether it is or not) is no good to the communities of Colyton, Appledore and Kingsteignton. This should not be something for another document and neither should mobile libraries. Otherwise you may be seen as yet another example of a metropolitan sage attempting a one size fits all model that ignores the countryside, where accessibility is a much bigger issue than in Cricklewood.

You cover electric lights when mentioning libraries should be bright. I have no problem with that so fail to undertsand why you choose to ignore the value of websites, which make some parts of a library service easier to use not necessarily for everyone but certainly for those who are busy, work very unsocial hours or live in a rural area away from their library amongst others.

I still think you are weak on catering for children. Not every child wants to be read to but there is value for very many not least when they are very young. You wouldn't leave the availability of obscure, international reference books for research to individual libraries, which not all of us want either. I am just trying to say that libraries for children are dealt with in a hasty way that deserves more attention so that there are opportunities to meet a diversity of need that is fully described for adults but not I think for children.

On marketing you praised the summer reading challenge in I think Bedfordshire on the blog recently. This didn't just happen in Bedfordshire but probably almost everywhere in the country. This sort of initiative does have value as you say but is greatly assisted by marketing and national marketing to save libraries reinventing wheels, in the way you describe for things IT. That is why I mentioned it.

Best wishes

Phil

Phil

Actually I would leave the decision about whether or not to stock obscure international references works to an individual local library! I would share the budget out and let each library spend their portion in the way they see fit.

I'm not trying to avoid the need for an abundant and diverse service for children. I completely agree with you. It just takes too long to describe here. But I would want a child, or a parent, to say "they go out of their way to help"-- I only intend that as a catch- all, a seal of approval, but I agree with you it covers a huge range of activities

Of course I'm not against centrally organised activities like the "Summer Reading Challenge", but I believe that in the main part the marketing of libraries should be for what they do (make reading material available) rather than the pious wishes that are expressed about them ("Love Libraries") and that there is already a tremendous brand recognition and volume of national marketing (from publishers)that already exists. I stick to my point that the best national marketing campaign for libraries is one which would mean they hold better stock.

Correspondents on here are saying, for example, that very few libraries have copies of this year's Booker short list available. I know, because I look for more mundane things, that very few libraries are carrying this year's Bed and Breakfast guides to the Lake District. Until that kind of thing is put right, national marketing will only highlight the weaknesses of the service, not the reasons for visiting it.

When my first book was published in 1989, in England and by a small publisher, it was reprinted twice before the publication date in part because of library purchases. That happened because it was chosen one of the Top 20 Green Books in a promotion sponsored by the Observer. Libraries and book stores were involved in the Green Book Fortnight, and as a new author I benefited amazingly. So I don't understand how they can not even have the Booker short list titles!

They can not, Karen, because they buy very very few books at all. My last crime novel sold around 40,000 copies in hardback through bookshops and around 100 to all the libraries in the UK. Very few libraries buy new books now. Things have changed mightily since 1989.
And if Clive Keeble patronises me and insults once more, without knowing me or anything about me, by assuming that because I chance to be white, middle-aged and middle class I have neither knowledge of or interest in or sympathies with, multi-cultural inner city housing estates, I will scream. He knows NOTHING about what I do, who I know, where I go, where I grew up, or where I choose to spend or give my money.
You simply cannot make these assumptions.
It is also patronising to the poor, working and multi-racial inhabitants of anywhere to assume that they need 'ideas'[ and 'community space' rather than good books. Nothing wrong with space for meetings and children and whatever.. AS WELL AS BOOKS NOT INSTEAD OF THEM.
I educated myself upwards socially and to a good university and thence to becoming a published writer and to making my living largely because of books in free libraries. So did very very many people. Education is the only way outwards and upwards from poverty and poor living conditions and that fashionable phrase 'social exclusion.' Education should be free both in and out of school.. and one of the few places in which people can educate themselves is the public library.. by borrowing and reading a huge range of books. That has been true for over a century. It is still true.
Community events and meetings and computer games and pilates classes may be fun and provide some social benefits - but they do NOT provide an education.

Mark Field, in his speech to the Libraries conference last week referred to the technophile young researchers in his office. I have a vision of a room full of charming and attractive (though diverse)young people. These will be the arrowheads of Mark's "Task Force" and go out seeking agreement from Tory Councillors everywhere on the right way to proceed with the improvements that Mark and Hugo Swire want to see.

I know that fleetingly, in the course of their painstaking meticulous research into the library needs of the nation, they occasionally pass by this blog, for entertainment, if no cricket match is taking place that is more interesting.

My question to these influential people is: do you agree with the statements made above on what a public library should do? Could this be something the Conservative party will strive to achieve?

Tim

I would hate Susan Hill to scream !! - see above : jeezh, I get frigging fed up with people that wish to misinterpret my words trying to suggest that I am speaking about them.

On all information before me, book lending and usage within the Tower Hamlets Ideas Stores is vibrant.

This is potentially a very busy week for both myself and my business ; therefore you must excuse me if I don't get further involved at this time.

In that case, my borough (Southwark) accounts for 20% of your library hardback sales, Susan! Perhaps I should count my blessings...

I think Tim and I nearly agree above although we are both probably too stubborn to admit this here? I still think that he should elaborate a little more on libraries for children and some valuable projects will require some marketing as I have described but would agree that an expensive national whizzbang like love libraries is over the top and thought I had said so. However he then got on to buying Booker novels, which prompted Susan to say libraries had only bought around 100 copies of her latest - Risk of Darkness I think.

I know Tim will say we should be buying more but the situation is less bleak than 100 copies in libraries nationwide. It may be that way soon but from looking at no more than a dozen web catalogues I have found nearly 200 copies. More than 100 in just Cornwall, Lanacashire, Norfolk, Suffolk and Devon. There must be at least 1,000 I should think and probably more. Not good enough maybe but better than .....

Phil

Very much agree with what has been said here, the emphasis upon books.

All through the long struggle to save Hove Library, and now with its happy re-opening after the repairs etc., I have ben struck by the great appetite for books.

It seems to me that the MLA etc like things to be visible, perennial signs of activity, when in fact a great, necessarily unspoken joy of reading is that it is a solitary one (which of course is distinct from lonely).

It was over three hundred years ago that Pascal observed that "all the misfortunes of men derive from one single thing, which is their inability to be at ease in a room".

So, the more public libraries, with more books, the better the chance for world peace.

I'm sorry, this really perplexes me. I'd have thought Susan would get accurate figures about her library sales, but I've just done a quick check of the catalogues of the libraries in the East Midlands, Birmingham and Essex. I assume we are talking about "The Risk of Darkness". Holdings are:

Derbyshire & Derby City: 31
Leicester City: 4
Leicestershire & Rutland: 11
Lincolnshire: 9
Northamptonshire: 10
Nottinghamshire & Nottingham City: 14
Birmingham: 17
Essex: 14

I make that 110 copies just in the first 11 authorities I checked, out of the 149 in the UK. There were clearly many more than 100 were sold to libraries nationwide - perhaps there has been some delay in reporting figures?

Links to all UK public library catalogues:
http://dspace.dial.pipex.com/town/square/ac940/weblibs.html

Happily, it seems like a lot of them are out on loan.

Duchess: There is nothing odd here. Neither an author nor a publisher knows the number of copies which are sold to libraries via a wholesaler. Until recently all the library suppliers bought a large portion of their books from the various wholesalers. So it is quite likely that a larger quantity of Susan's books have arrived through this route rather than from the direct sales of which she will see details.

The same would be true of book shop customers of wholesalers: the wholesalers do not (normally) reveal the quantities they sell to individual accounts and authors and publishers do not know this detail. They only know the quantities they have sold directly.

This is important- but I am more concerned to receive comments about the idea of a public library before I suggest that this is what councils should be invited to sign up to. Tim

I cannot understand what this argument is about. There is simply nothing to discuss. A library is a place for BOOKS, BOOKS, BOOKS and nothing else (obviously there have to be computers nowadays, I know) but the following quote has been taken from an entry of a few weeks ago in my blog called I Love Libraries and I stand by it:

"The definition of a library shown below is taken from the Concise Oxford English dictionary:

Library: a building or room containing a collection of books and periodicals for use by the public or the members of an institution; a collection of books held in a library

Origin: from the Latin libraria ‘bookshop’ from liber book

I see no mention of computers, coffee shops or Christmas cards. Do you?"

Any other activity at a library is fine but it should be, as Susan Hill say, is in ADDITION to books not a replacement.

Well, the Roman library contained mostly scrolls. the codex came in in the Christian era. Libraries have always collected material in a variety of media, and should be provided with the money to continue to do so. Much of modern scientific discovery is recorded in electronic journals. What about music? Would you banish recorded sound and scores? Or the globes, maps and other realia many libraries hold? Moving images? I could go on...

I'm sorry I was distracted by the correspondance, rather than the question at hand.

I think it is a pretty good summary of what a library service should offer. There are a few quibbles, but on the whole I would have no problem supporting it. I'd put "open as long as possible", rather than "as long as it is safe to be so", but that is probably just semantics.